Dilema, calling the experts! CHOOSING ENGINE!

[lifesnotfair]

Fellas. I have a big dilema.. first, let me clear the situation for everyone. I have an 88, N/A automatic. Been doing some stuff to it, but mostly exterior/interior, upgrading tails, front end, etc. Nothing engine-wise so far. Having owned a '90 Z32 TT and an 87 FC T, I must say I love the feeling of the turbo on these RWD cars. And I want it back. (With manual tranny, as I've always had previous to this car).

Now, here's the problem: here in the Dominican Republic, the 7M-GTE has a BAAAAAAAAAAD reputation. Every mechanic I talk to, says they tend to blow. Everyone who has owned one, says has had to buy at least 2-3-4, coz they all blow. They say is CRAP. They all tell me that if I wanna go faster on my car, to drop a 1JZ would be the best choice. I know if I get an '89 crossmember (or buy some mounting things I saw on some website for $175 dollars), the 1JZ would fit perfectly in my engine bay, looking and fitting "stock". But I hear in the forums that it's a harder swap. Please note that ANY swap that I do, wont be done by myself, but by the shop. So I don't care how hard it is. The shop in here doesn't actually charge that much for the swap, I think labour costs would be pretty much the same for both engine swaps. What's very different, is the price of the engine itself.

From what I've heard (please correct me if I'm wrong): 1JZ's don't break. They just don't. But parts are harder to find, and doing the wiring harness and stuff might be more complicated, as well as mounting it... Also, costs twice as much as the 7M-GTE in here.

And 7M-GTE: it needs to be BABIED to last long, but parts are easy to find, and swap is easier to do.

Now, I'm not very good with mechanics, and I don't wanna be putting the engine appart every now and then. This is my daily driver and I just want a 14 sec 1/4 mile car, not a drag car.. so I wouldn't be modding it too much. Maybe exhaust, air filter.. I wouldn't be doing big turbo, big intercooler, big everything, no.. Not for now.

Another problem I have is that I don't know exactly what "re-building a 7M" means. How much money are we talking about? I mean, all I know is that I have to use a good head gasket (metal, if going over 300whp, right?), and ARP bolts for the head. I've heard lubrication is bad on this engines. Say I buy one, what would I need to do, exactly, to be able to put on many miles on it without busting it?

As I said, I don't wanna be fixing stuff on a weekly basis. I want the car to behave well, and not to be changing parts all the time, changing gaskets and other stuff all the time, etc... So because of this, I'm kinda leaning towards the 1JZ option, as they say it can take a lot of beating and came with no factory flaws like the 7M did.

I just don't know what to do. I have the money to do either swap, but I'd like to spend as little as possible to fulfill my desire of having a "fast" car again. And don't wanna be buying parts all the time in the future either... I know a swap must have it's problems, but they'll show in the following weeks/couple of months after, but I don't wanna be changing stuff all the time 1 year later still, because the darned engine just keeps breaking something :-( ... Like I said, I'm totally lost here.

 

[GotToyota?]

If you don't want a 7M-GTE, I say either go with a 1G-GTE or 1JZ-GTE.

 

[MKIIINA]

fix the headgasket once and fix it right and you set really. keep an eye on your fluids and your set.

1jz and all will break. any motor will. if you neglict it and dont watch your levels you will break a motor no problem.

if they are sloppy with the swap you wll have problems with the 1jz just as you would with the 7m. your call man

 

[Stretch]

Either 1UZ or 3UZ. V8 NA power and you could turbo if ya felt lucky.
eric

 

[Wendigo]

What kinda power does the 1UZFE put out?

 

[UkiSash]

I say support the growing 1jz fam here in the U.S.

I dont know if this is correct but here is the way i look at it

7M-gte, lets say 450 HP, you need to spend 3k to build up your internals etc. etc.

1jz-gte, lets say 450 HP, you buy a clip, about 3500, still get more HP than a 7m and you can build it to whatever level you like, so far ive seen ppl go over 550 HP. Exhaust, intake, some turbo and fuel upgrades, tune and your a boost happy freak with throttle happy right foot.



On the lower end HP your best bet is 1j, at the higher levels like over 600 HP i hear that thouse two really arent too much different in price wise.

 

[kssweeper28]

Build up the 7mgte and you wont have any problems if you do all proper maintenance when needed. Always watch your oil levels,etc. 7m all the way.

 

[Adjuster]

I think in both cases, money=speed/reliability. The more you spend on parts, the more likely they are to hold up well at higher power levels.

You are saying you just want a 14 second car, the 7MGTE is that easy, with a modified CT, or easy bolt on turbo.

Since your car is a NA, your going to need the 7MGTE ECU, and wire harness, and complete 7MGTE engine to do this right. Also the intercooler of your choice and some IC hard pipes. This all adds costs to the swap. It might be less money and work to just sell your NA and buy a complete turbo car to start with. (Better transmission, and you start with all the rights parts from the begining.)

The 1JZ is a stout motor, but it is only 2.5L v/s 3.0, and even with turbo's, displacement matters. (My 7MGTE is stroked to 3.24L and has about 100lbs more tourqe than before at the same boost levels at the wheels.)

Force enough air and fuel into any motor, and it's going to make power, but around town, the larger displacement engine is going to have more grunt off the line, off boost, and build boost faster in most cases on similar sized turbo's.

That being said, it's your car, your choices and good luck either way you decide to go.

 

[figgie]

eso mekanicos que tu tienes en la Republica Domincana no saben ni mierda!!!

But with that out of the way

I would say do what you think will benfit you. As was stated before, I don't care if the engine is made by god himself. If the engine does not have what it needs it WILL break.

 

[figgie]

Another problem I have is that I don't know exactly what "re-building a 7M" means. How much money are we talking about? I mean, all I know is that I have to use a good head gasket (metal, if going over 300whp, right?), and ARP bolts for the head. I've heard lubrication is bad on this engines. Say I buy one, what would I need to do, exactly, to be able to put on many miles on it without busting it?

Rebuilding the 7m entails

Taking the motor COMPLETELY appart.
Hot tank motor block
Machine the deck
Bore out block to the size of NEW pistons [This musy be done with the pistons in hand so the machine shop can bore out the block according to the pistons).
Replacing Rod bearings
Replacing Main bearing
replace oil pump
New Freeze plugs
Machine and rebuild head.

that is about it.

To do it all right takes about 1500 dollars not including the engine. If you go JDM. A used engine is a used enginer

 

[MRSUPRA]

Sounds like theres a lot of bad mechanics in the Dominican Republic. A 14 second 7M powered car is nothing. Just retorqing the 7M head will give you fool proof way to a make 210-260rwhp (which is about all you need to run a 14 second 1/4 mile). You can tell your boys down in the Dominican that you have heard from at least one guy that has been running running around in a near 500rwhp stock internaled 7M for over 2 1/2 years with dead reliablility. Ok, I have a MHG and ARP headbolts, but thats no big deal.

 

[lifesnotfair]

I didn't quite get that last bit. If I go JDM, what??

And figgie: where are you from? You sounded dominican....

 

[lifesnotfair]

MRSUPRA: Yeah, but did you have to do everything figgie mentioned above? Coz that would be a pain. And I don't trust the machine shops in here too much, really... I think I'm better off with the 1JZ as I don't have to bore or machine anything. =(

 

[supradan22]

Im half dominican and I would say go 7m and rebuild it if possible if you just want a used motor then go for the 1j.

 

[MRSUPRA]

It doesn't cost a lot to have a stock intenaled 7M rebuilt. Probably less than most used 1JZ engines. Then you have a new engine and no hassles with the install. I have about 35k miles on my 7M since it was rebuilt by the previous owner. The only real flaw in the 7M is the factory torque specs on the headgasket. Other than that, its just a bunch of poor maintanance tactics thats lead to all of the 7M problems. I also believe the headgasket is blown so often because the rest of the engine holds up so well to all the bad tuning and detonation.

 

[figgie]

I didn't quite get that last bit. If I go JDM, what??

And figgie: where are you from? You sounded dominican....

bumping this

Soy de Miami, Florida original mente. Dialekto Cubano que es paresido al dialecto dominicano

About the JDM thing.

You hear everyone and there mother talking about JDM engine this and that. In the end the JDM engine has been used. A rebuild is new.

 

[GrimJack]

Rebuilt 7M is better than a used 1J in my opinion.

When both are new, it would be a tough choice. I've stuck with the 7M based on the fact that parts are easy to find and everyone knows them, whereas mechanics familiar with the 1J are rare.

 

[Dziuggy]

7M-gte, lets say 450 HP, you need to spend 3k to build up your internals etc. etc.

big bs. rebuilt 7m can easily handle ~500rwhp on stock internals and head.

1jz-gte, lets say 450 HP, you buy a clip, about 3500, still get more HP than a 7m and you can build it to whatever level you like, so far ive seen ppl go over 550 HP. Exhaust, intake, some turbo and fuel upgrades, tune and your a boost happy freak with throttle happy right foot.

to get over 550rwhp on 1j you need lots more money than 7m (clip 2000+, harness extension, instalation). also single kits for 1j tend to be more expencive than 7m (because you can get t4 adapter for 7m ($100) + nice turbo for about a $1000 easy) and 1j you will need new manifold whitch is expencive. i would say that corectly done 550rwhp 1j will run you at least 10000usd. now 7m can be done for less than 5000 including engine rebuild. (on stock manifold+ 550cc + walbro + safc)

and dont get me wrong 1j is an exelent engine but if mechanics there cant deal with 7m how do you know that they can work on 1j that they never even seen before

 

[lifesnotfair]

Dziuggy: Actually, they're quite familiar with 1JZ / 2JZ. And they talk very well of them. There are some 700+ MK4's in here. And I've seen 1JZ's even in pickups. That's thing, the mechanics all say "7M sucks, get a 1JZ!" and people listen to them. I think I'll just buy a used 7m-gte, get the internals that need replacement, and tell them "build this, it's what I'm paying you for. Yes, the motor sucks, blah blah, but build it and throw it in"... lol.