Cam Seals or HeadGasket?

[GreenChevelleSS]

Well I pulled the plate behind the cam gears to look see about an oil leak and I notice theres oil all the way up to the cam seals but the most is down on the head. Well I figured it was the head gasket but now im second guessing that it might be the cam seals. They were replaced during the rebuild 1000 miles ago but its been leaking there ever since the first run. So what do you guys think is leaking?
I know its hard to tell with out looking at it but looking at it isnt making it much easier.
Im thinking about putting the gears back on with out the plate and driving it and seeing if i can tell then but would that cause a problem running without that plate? Like the seals coming out or something?
:1zhelp:
thanks
danny

 

[cjsupra90]

seal will sometimes leak for a short bit after a rebuild, but not really that much if any. If the cams have excessive wear grooves in them, then that could also a problem.

I'd try the cam seals first.

Couple of questions for you though, did you use any sealant on the joint section where the front cover attaches to the block under the headgasket and also how about in the cornes where the first cam caps attach to the head (both #1 cam caps and both side of each cam cap)?

 

[cjsupra90]

to add to my last post, yes you can run without the back plate.

Also, is it possible for you to take a pic or 2 and post them?

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

well Im pretty sure its the cam seals now cause I took off the plate and ran it and it looked like it was coming from the cam seals.

I did use sealant on the bottom side of the head gasket where that plate attaches but I totally forgot about putting it on the top side of the gasket.
I also put sealant on the #1 cam caps.

I will get a closer look tomorrow afternoon and maybe get some pictures.
Thanks for the reply

 

[Nick M]

A cam seal installed correctly will not leak when installed after a rebuild. I suspect they are not installed correctly. Possibly a bit crooked in there.

 

[cjsupra90]

no, no need for sealant on the top side of the headgasket, just the bottom.

 

[hottscennessey]

Make sure your PCV system is up to par (no breathers), This could have caused the cam seals to blow, or blow again if there are problems. Make sure cam seals are fully inserted, i used a PVC pipe the same size as the seal and gently tapped them in place with a hammer.

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

my PCV is stock, how could I check it?
I think the seals were just crappy from the factory. I bought a cheap brand gasket kit and I guess the cam seals just werent good. I could put the originals back in but im gonna go buy toyota brand new ones

Also how did you get the old ones out with out pulling the front cam caps?

It took me 4 times to get the valve timing set right back and I think I still have it set 4 or 5 degrees advanced. Any tips you guys can give me at getting this timing set right?

 

[Joel W.]

I just loosened my caps and used a hooked pick tool. Pop the new ones in and retighten the caps..

I dont know about anyone else, but I always put a thin coat of grease or oil on the seal before I install them.

On the timing, the intake side of the belt should be tight down to the crank. All the slack should be on the tensioner/exhaust side..

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

I always put oil on the inside of the seal and the shaft that they are sliding on.
So I cant get them out without loosening the cam caps? Do I have to loosen the valve covers to loosen the cam caps?

 

[Nick M]

Yes the valve cover needs to be off to remove the first cap. FIPG is required when installing the end cap. Did you apply it?

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

Fipg?

 

[Joel W.]

I did not have to remove the valve covers to the best of my recollections ....
They are outside the valve cover I think? I will look at the TSRM now...??

After looking at the TSRM, the bolts are exposed. So I just loosened them slightly enough to take some of the tension off the seals..

*form in place gasket*

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

We used Permetex Gray RTV sealant.

 

[mrnickleye]

Don't loosen the caps. Use a coat hanger and make a little hook to slip in beside the camshaft, then pull out, and slide it 180* around and pull, working the seal out.
Put a coating of motor oil on the new seal, all over it, and position into place, and use the old seal and small hammer to tap it into place.

Or use a large socket.

 

[Joel W.]

Mrnickleye is probably right. It is not necessary to remove the caps, but mine were stuck in there really tight and I was bending my pick tool trying to remove them.. I did not mean to post bad info??

 

[GreenChevelleSS]

its alright I see what you are saying tho.
I ordered some today from the dealer so hopefully I can get them in and see if that stops all my oil loss.