Any experiences with the Rigid Collar product on a MKIII?

[loc182]

So back in 2010ish Spoon sports "invented" these little things called "Rigid Collars". They are designed to increase rigidity of the chassis by ensuring perfect alignment between it and the subframes.

There is a video that explains what the Rigid Collars do here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWyUD6UXfog

And this is the website of the only non-Japanese official dealer I have found:

http://www.rigidcollar.com/index.php/

I have to admit, I am very intrigued. The concept behind these things makes sense, but for a three year old product there is not a lot of feedback available.

This SpeedHunters article is probably the best bit of feedback I have found, but it could be a bit biased:

http://www.speedhunters.com/2011/06/car_life_gt_gt_fitting_rigid_collars_to_the_gt_r/

The article upped my interest, so I continued looking for Japanese reviews and videos. While I didn't find much outside of paid promotionals, I didn't find any reports of negative experiences. People were either amazed at the difference the Rigid Collars made or felt they offered only minor improvement. Regardless of experience everyone did note that you couldn't show the effects of these things, one had to feel them by driving a car before and after installation.

At this point I was torn. Perhaps the benefit users observed was simply a side effect of having the subframe bolts retightened? Despite these reservations I was still ready to jump in and give the Rigid Collars a shot...but the price stopped me in my tracks. It would cost around $500 to get the Rigid Collars for the front and rear of the MKIII. This just seemed a bit extreme to me. And to make matters worse these things crush during installation so I believe they are a one use item. (Maybe you could use matchmarks to reuse them in case something has to come off?)

So I was just wondering if anyone has tried these or a similar product out on a Supra?

 

[Poodles]

LOL @ improves noise and vibration. If you rigidly mount the subframes, noise and vibration will be worse not better.

Then again this is for vehicles without isolators like our cars. Aluminum subframe spacers would be required to get any real benefit from them.

 

[yhatzee89]

So this is the equivalent of solid subframe spacers for other cars?

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

Keep in mind that many A70 owners are "Amazed at the difference that strut braces make"

I bought a strut brace, and indeed, I thought that it made things better... Then I decided to test to see what it's actually doing.

Install strut brace endpoints on the strut towers, bolt aluminum bar stock to each mount, but not to each other. In the middle where they meet, strap them together with elastic bands. Put a sharp screw through one, towards the other, so that if the bars rub (IE, the distance between the strut towers expands or contracts) it will make a scratch in the other.

Go for a drive. Hit some bumps, shoot some corners, have some fun.

Carefully disassemble the bars, and look at the length of the scratch in the one bar.

In my case, it was barely even visible as anything but a dot. There was less than 2mm length of scratch, which could have been up and down vibration of the bars when hitting bumps, rather than the strut towers moving.

The moral of the story is that placebo effect is alive and well. If they cannot show you what difference the collars make, and you need a testimonial to know that there is a difference, then I will assume that there is no difference at all. A test similar to the one that I just described can show that there is/is not movement of the subframes relative to the chassis. In the case of our cars, there is supposed to be movement, but elimination of that movement may not improve handling, in the same way that replacing a shock absorber with a solid bar will not improve your car's handling.

 

[loc182]

Thanks for all the comments and insight!

Happily I have my own inexpensive solution for rigidity:
1. Drive without targa.
2. Lament chassis flex.
3. Re-install targa.
4. Rejoice!

 

[Poodles]

Retorquing the subframes will make a significant difference on many cars. Mine for example was VERY loose on the front (threads where showing between the nuts and subframe)

 

[Maple191]

You should replace sub-frame bolts after they are removed. Ive seen it to many times wheres so much rust that the threads are all pitted away. causing it more likely to back off.

 

[Poodles]

You should replace sub-frame bolts after they are removed. Ive seen it to many times wheres so much rust that the threads are all pitted away. causing it more likely to back off.

No rust down here (we don't use salt during the winter)

If you happen to live in an area that does use salt, subframe bolts are probably the least of your worries...

 

[loc182]

That was kind of my original suspicion, that the retorquing of the sub frame bolts as a part of Rigid Collar installation was causing the "amazing" feel. And of course the placebo effect, something was done so something should be different!

 

[Poodles]

Well, in the video they're using a new car so the retorque shouldn't have any real effect...

 

[suprajztwenty]

for that kit front and rear is $562(us), no thanks..

 

[Poodles]

You're more than likely paying for the name and not the part.

Also, it looks like maybe they come with aluminum subframe spacers as well. Not a bad kit, but I wouldn't ever do it simply from a noise and vibration standpoint.

 

[loc182]

Good point about the video, but I was thinking more the user testimonials. There were always used cars, and I think the official Japanese promo showed a car with about 50K km. Cause in Japan, after 50K km cars are ready for the scrapyard (I had to let my SW20 MR2 go for about $1000 when I left Japan because 67K km was high mileage...)

Speaking of that video...why a Prius!?! They show an S2000 at one point, and then BAM! Prius.